Bin Laden is dead.

[unclefrank]

Come on now, there's no need to poke fun at us as Americans for the fact that it took us so long to find this man. The bottom line is he killed thousands of innocent people, and his death is relief to us all. September 11 was a horrible day in American history. We can sleep a little better now knowing that justice has been served.

One thing I've learned from this site is that many non-Americans will find any reason to bash the USA.  Let them have it...remember who's on top!  I just think it's funny how they get their panties in a bunch if you say anything negative about their little country.

I just don't see the need for it is all. I mean, is there a legitimate rule of thumb concerning how long it should take to locate a wanted a terrorist? If the U.S. had found Osama in 2003, we would most likely have heard the same thing 'It ONLY took 2 years."  Non-Americans saying things like that is just silly, and probably just a way to get something stirred up.

I can't change the fact that I'm a natural born citizen, that's just the hand that I was dealt. Being born where I was born doesn't make me better than anyone else, but it does make an American. I may not show my 'patriotism' by getting drunk and parading down the street with an American flag in tow, yet I can say with ease that knowing the man who was ultimately  in charge of the 9/11 attacks on my home turf is not longer active does give me some sanction. That is all. If this happened to another country instead of the states, I'd certainly understand their point of view on the situation, and not try to pointlessly criticize them by pointing out the matter of time it took to find the one in charge.

I'm completely aware that America is nowhere near perfect. I know this isn't 1950 anymore and realize Americans, for the most part, thinks that their sh*t doesn't stink. However, a lot of us (I'd say quite a handful of ESLers here) Don't fit in your American stereotype mold.

This place sometimes sounds more like Dave's ESL

[justanotherwaygook]

I'm completely aware that America is nowhere near perfect. I know this isn't 1950 anymore and realize Americans, for the most part, thinks that their sh*t doesn't stink.

Say that to a black person.

[elspeth]

I'm completely aware that America is nowhere near perfect. I know this isn't 1950 anymore and realize Americans, for the most part, thinks that their sh*t doesn't stink.

Say that to a black person.

This is not a serious post.

[cinamon]

Was there ever concrete proof that he was behind 9/11?

He said he was behind it. If he wasn't behind it then why would he claim to be? Attract attention? He attracted attention alright and the US hunted him down and killed him.

What happened to innocent until proven guilty?  Lots of people confess to murders/crimes they didn't commit. This is nothing but murder.

[Wacky Fritz]

Well it's a good thing he was killed and not taken alive.

That would have been a disaster...

[gookway]

why couldn't they post a youtube video of this??? Imagine how many hits it would have received.  About 1 billion views.  It would be the most watched youtube video of all time!!!! Major revenue from adsense and google ads :)

[hadley]

For those who are comparing the celebrations that are happenning right now in the USA over the death of Osama Bin Laden and the hope that the war could be one step closer to coming to an end (optimistic thinking I know) and the celebration that took place in the mid. east when 3,000 innocent lives where taken within hours on Sep. 11, 2001. Should really rethink things. 
I know Sep. 11, 2001 was a long time ago. Some people have sadly forgotten the ramifications of that day while other are still faced with it everyday wether is be the empty spot in the New Your sky line or for some the empty spot at the kitchen table.
Try and think of more then what's right in front of you before you post insensitive things.

[Belle]

Check this out and you can watch the speech...go down!

http://thinkprogress.org/2011/05/01/osama-bin-laden-is-dead/

[cinamon]

For those who are comparing the celebrations that are happenning right now in the USA over the death of Osama Bin Laden and the hope that the war could be one step closer to coming to an end (optimistic thinking I know) and the celebration that took place in the mid. east when 3,000 innocent lives where taken within hours on Sep. 11, 2001. Should really rethink things. 
I know Sep. 11, 2001 was a long time ago. Some people have sadly forgotten the ramifications of that day while other are still faced with it everyday wether is be the empty spot in the New Your sky line or for some the empty spot at the kitchen table.
Try and think of more then what's right in front of you before you post insensitive things.

The civilians in Afghanistan and Iraq, and now also Libya, are also getting their villages and homes burned to the ground.  Who will give them justice?

This shameless celebration is savage and pompous.

[Yu_Bumsuk]

I just heard Obama's speech in which he called the 9/11 attacks the 'worst attack on the American people in our history'. I guess the Cherokee who died on the Trail of Tears weren't 'American people'?

[minamteacher]

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Huh? Oh....sorry guys, I was just bashing my head on the keyboard because of how ridiculous some of these posts are. Is there ever really ever any need for crapping on another country's people? No one who claims to have an open mind would hate an entire country for the actions of its government nor would someone think that one country is responsible for peace in the western world.

I totally agree with what you said. I wish everybody on this thread would take a DEEP BREATH before they post. The issue of Osama Bin Laden is VERY emotionally charged for everybody (not just Americans), so things you say can really hurt people. Heck, I don't even know WHY people are talking about this on a teaching forum.

[JamericanTeacher]

Warning: rant...

I actually think we do know our sh*t stinks.  It's just that those are our sh*t to work out within our society.  When I'm home, I'm a black carribean-american who is aware of and involved in helping to solve the challenges my local community and general society face.  When I'm home I criticize the govt and damn near hate them bc everywhere you turn they're somehow screwing us over.... When i'm overseas, however, I'm an American damn-it!... and will defend America against anyone who bashes it...We have our flaws, but, damn-it, its still one hell of a country...

And btw, I hope all the folks who are criticizing our reaction to Bin Laden's death will manage to stay on those HIGH HORSES of theirs if GOD FORBID, they lose a loved on in a terrorist attack.  Bet you wont be talking about america's foreign policy then.  Nope. You'll be saying, my loved one didnt have a damn thing to do with america's foreign policy...I mean, think about it.  we elect our officials to build our roads, balance the budget, protect medicare and social security, fix our schools, and protect us.  We don't really know half the crap they're doing covertly.  Do you know about every covert operation your govt engages in Brits, Canadians and Saffos?....My guess is no.  and if you say yes, you're lying....the average citizen shouldnt accept any blame for what our govts so overseas bc 9 out of 10 times, we don't know about it, and when we find out about it we become outraged and vote them out of office...

...And another thing.  Other countries have SOME NERVE bashing America for anything.  Hello African colonialists.  Yes, Britain, France, Germany, Italy, Spain, Portugal, etc., I'm talking to you!...and thats just one continent!

 





[/quote]
I'm completely aware that America is nowhere near perfect. I know this isn't 1950 anymore and realize Americans, for the most part, thinks that their sh*t doesn't stink. However, a lot of us (I'd say quite a handful of ESLers here) Don't fit in your American stereotype mold.

This place sometimes sounds more like Dave's ESL
[/quote]

[tardigrade]

I'll probably get flamed, too, but I must get this off my chest.  The man was responsible for the death of thousands.  My country (USA) had every right to go after him.  I'm tired of countries that are jealous of our strength, wealth, influence, and power bashing us.  Go USA.  I will NEVER apologize for my country.

I love the idea of the United States. It is the most powerful country on earth for a reason. However, the things that made it great are long gone. That so many people hate the place is a manifestation of that. Some people hate the US for a reason. Overseas aggression is more than part of that reason.

I wonder where Canada and many other western countries would be without the States and what it would be like if the USA didn't do any of the dirty work that needs to get done.  It must be so nice to talk about how great a country you have when you can just ride the coat tails of the USA.

Where would other countries be without the USA? Well, if American debtors called in their debts, their wouldn't be much left of the good old US of A.

http://www.visualeconomics.com/where-is-americas-debt/.

I like the US but I hate all this stupid inane flag waving that some folk seem to love so much. And what is the USA number 1 at exactly? It is continuously at/near the bottom of the league compared to other OECD nation in regards to indicators of education/crime/equality health etc etc. It should really be near the top.

As for Osama. I'm not interested in whether he is alive or dead.

[DMZ]

Warning: rant...

I actually think we do know our sh*t stinks.  It's just that those are our sh*t to work out within our society.  When I'm home, I'm a black carribean-american who is aware of and involved in helping to solve the challenges my local community and general society face.  When I'm home I criticize the govt and damn near hate them bc everywhere you turn they're somehow screwing us over.... When i'm overseas, however, I'm an American damn-it!... and will defend America against anyone who bashes it...We have our flaws, but, damn-it, its still one hell of a country...

And btw, I hope all the folks who are criticizing our reaction to Bin Laden's death will manage to stay on those HIGH HORSES of theirs if GOD FORBID, they lose a loved on in a terrorist attack.  Bet you wont be talking about america's foreign policy then.  Nope. You'll be saying, my loved one didnt have a damn thing to do with america's foreign policy...I mean, think about it.  we elect our officials to build our roads, balance the budget, protect medicare and social security, fix our schools, and protect us.  We don't really know half the crap they're doing covertly.  Do you know about every covert operation your govt engages in Brits, Canadians and Saffos?....My guess is no.  and if you say yes, you're lying....the average citizen shouldnt accept any blame for what our govts so overseas bc 9 out of 10 times, we don't know about it, and when we find out about it we become outraged and vote them out of office...

...And another thing.  Other countries have SOME NERVE bashing America for anything.  Hello African colonialists.  Yes, Britain, France, Germany, Italy, Spain, Portugal, etc., I'm talking to you!...and thats just one continent!

 

I get what you're saying. No country is perfect. I moan and complain about my own country endlessly but I will go nuts on someone not from my country if they criticize it. It's like a sibling relationship.

HOWEVER... Human beings should never stop questioning and criticizing authority whether it's their own government or the government of one of the world's greatest superpowers. Progress and positive change can only come through criticism and pointing out flaws, however hurtful it may seem.

[jh64487]

I like the US but I hate all this stupid inane flag waving that some folk seem to love so much. And what is the USA number 1 at exactly?

War and free market economics.

[Death Walrus]

In reply to JamaicanTeacher rant...

Blind loyalty to any country is a shallow form of homicide. The only reason I'm an American is due to a series of chance events that resulted in my birth at a set of coordinates that happen to fall in the USA. Why would these circumstances encourage me (or anyone from any country) to be proud or pledge my allegiance to a group of people on a plot of land? I support humans and act on what makes the good ones happier and healthier. Nationalism is the death of intelligence.

[Horus]

Was there ever concrete proof that he was behind 9/11?

He said he was behind it. If he wasn't behind it then why would he claim to be? Attract attention? He attracted attention alright and the US hunted him down and killed him.

What happened to innocent until proven guilty?  Lots of people confess to murders/crimes they didn't commit. This is nothing but murder.

Killing bin Laden is murder. Now I've heard everything.

[tardigrade]

I like the US but I hate all this stupid inane flag waving that some folk seem to love so much. And what is the USA number 1 at exactly?

War and free market economics.

War? OK you got that one. Free market economics? - Somalia is much better

[Brit_1]

Here is the issue, America.

If you wanted international recognition for this, why did you kill him? He was shot in the head twice, there is no need. If you are able to get two clean head shots you could have easily just taken him down. Was it so hard to take him alive? Put him on trial? Make him answerable for his crimes? There is no doubt that he was a scumbag, but why not make him pay through old school courts and law? Rather than this stupid American ideal of 'if you kill someone we will kill you back'.

[flasyb]

In reply to JamaicanTeacher rant...

Blind loyalty to any country is a shallow form of homicide. The only reason I'm an American is due to a series of chance events that resulted in my birth at a set of coordinates that happen to fall in the USA. Why would these circumstances encourage me (or anyone from any country) to be proud or pledge my allegiance to a group of people on a plot of land? I support humans and act on what makes the good ones happier and healthier. Nationalism is the death of intelligence.

I agree with that sentiment. I'm British but I'm not proud to be British. Nor am I ashamed. I'm indifferent. My country has done some terrible things - empire, slavery, overthrowing countries, inventing the concentration camp, etc - and a few good things - standing up to the nazis, giving billions in foreign aid every year, ermmm hard to think of more. However, I did not do these things. I did not stand up to the Nazis, so I feel no national pride in that. I did not enslave anyone, so I feel no shame. Nationalism is simply taking pride in the achievements of others whilst ignoring (or getting your knickers in a twist about) any criticism.

Bin Laden is dead. In many ways he was a product of American foreign policy. Considered an ally and a freedom fighter (called such by Regan) when he was fighting against the Russians in Afghanistan with the mudjuhadin, he became an evil terrorist when he turned his weapons upon the hands that gave them. He wanted all foreign invading forces out of Islamic countries and the introduction of Sharia law. It is impossible for any group to fight head to head against the USA and its allies in the field so he took to guerilla tactics and terrorism. I think any group fighting against a vastly superior force would do the same, particularly if they believed (falsely or otherwise) that their cause was noble. If in some terrible future, the USA has collapsed and is invaded by a vastly superior foreign force, I get the feeling that there are many people in the States who would use any means necessary to defend their country and way of life - even using tactics decried as terrorism by their enemies.

I guess what I'm trying to say in this ramble is that notions of country bind us apart, not together. What is needed is a little more empathy from both sides. Americans (and their British, Australian, French etc allies) need to realise that they may well commit the same desperate acts if their situations were reversed, if a foreign invasion force was driving tanks down the streets of their towns, conducting midnight raids and abducting their citizens (cousins, brothers, daughters), deporting their citizens to other countries for torture in illegal prisons, raping them in prison and posing with their corpses. On the other hand, terrorist groups need to realise that the murder of innocent civilians will not cause the USA to stop its actions to secure oil in the Middle East and will only strengthen its resolve - a resolve demonstrated by the killing of the most wanted man in the world after a decade of searching.

BBC obituary for bin Laden. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-10741005