RUDE STUDENTS!!

[Yu_Bumsuk]

I feel like a lot of these topics/threads (student behavior related) are started by female teachers. I'm starting to wonder why. Are foreign female teachers easier targets for students? I wonder if korean female students have the same struggles.

I'm not trying to slander anyone, im just curious about the correlation.

Interesting - I've had similar observations. Students can sniff out a lack of confidence very easily. If you don't know the language and are new to teaching you're probably lacking in confidence somewhat. However if you're also of a smaller stature than some of the students, that has to be even more the case.

[hilarity ensues]

The biggest problem I have is that once they start with the holidays and the trips and the warmer weather, my students flip out.

At my school, attitudes go from manageable to difficult around May... it could have something to do with only having a month and a half before the summer break, I suppose... also, the holidays, school trips, exams, and 'free study periods'. Last week there were movies being shown so that the K teachers could make time to do whatever it is that they have to do that isn't actually teaching. The students have also bonded and are growing comfortable at the school and with each other being in whatever year they're in, so they're getting bolder.

You could try changing the seating plan-- that's one of my favorites... or I guess you could go with the whole 'be more entertaining' thing.   

[Jozigirl]

I feel like a lot of these topics/threads (student behavior related) are started by female teachers. I'm starting to wonder why. Are foreign female teachers easier targets for students? I wonder if korean female students have the same struggles.

I'm not trying to slander anyone, im just curious about the correlation.

Interesting - I've had similar observations. Students can sniff out a lack of confidence very easily. If you don't know the language and are new to teaching you're probably lacking in confidence somewhat. However if you're also of a smaller stature than some of the students, that has to be even more the case.

They can smell fear   As a female teacher, I do find that my boys are a little cheekier than my girls in that they'll make inappropriate comments and think that they're acceptable because "it's a man's world"  Having said that, however, I do think experience plays a huge role in how we handle students.

[KLM]

I don't allow my first-year, male, high school students to have any choice about where and with whom they sit. They must work with a partner that I choose and sit where I tell them. I create seating charts that I display via projector at the beginning of every class.

It is more work for me to make new seating charts and change the pairs every week or two, and it eats up class time to go through the "change your seats now, just like you've done every class since day 1" rigmarole at the beginning of every class, but it's worth it. My students now are far less rude than the students I had last year, before I introduced the seating charts.

[annab]

Find out who is the most feared teacher in your school. Ours is 'Min-ju' the P.E. teacher. Now day's I just have to say 'Min-ju' in a deep voice and a raised eyebrow. 

[Summer]

This is a great thread. I am glad to be involved in this discussion. I  have found it does work best when I REALLY reward good behavior and  punish bad behavior (as best as I can as a NT)

As for rewarding, I have a stamp system in place and those who participate in class and behave properly receive a stamp (I use my own stamp which I bought from Insadong for 5,000 won). And, as an extra incentive at the end of the semester I will pick the top 5 kids with the most stamps from each of my classes (I have 22 classes) and give them a certificate I printed off (from 123certificates.com) as well as choco-pie and an eraser or pencil (thank you Daiso!).  Generally, the korean students are really competitive so they like this idea of competing against each other for stuff. 

For my bad classes, I recently have had a bit of success making them sit boy/girl/boy/girl. First, I make all of them get up and the boys line up against one wall and the girls line up against another wall. And, then I hand pick how I want the students to sit boy/girl/boy/girl. I then tell them, "You act bad I will treat you like a baby and you will sit like this for the rest of the year, You behave well you can return to your old seats. Its completely your choice." And, I try to make sure I sit the really bad students in the very front so I can monitor them and control them via "the stare" which is where I stop class and stare at them until they stop acting horrible.
If they are extraordinarily bad, i.e. destroying the furniture, screaming in the middle of class, fighting, throwing pencils, throwing their shoes etc I stop class and tell them, " Push up position. Now." And, if they don't do that I then tell them, "Either you do the push up position, or I go visit the Principal right now. Its really your choice."   

Its really hard if you have a co-teacher who doesn't do anything, but generally I have found if you tell the students you will visit the VP or Principle's office its very effective.

The certificate thing is a really good idea!!! I'd imagine that the parents would be very happy that their kid brings home a certificate.

This is a great thread. I am glad to be involved in this discussion. I  have found it does work best when I REALLY reward good behavior and  punish bad behavior (as best as I can as a NT)

As for rewarding, I have a stamp system in place and those who participate in class and behave properly receive a stamp (I use my own stamp which I bought from Insadong for 5,000 won). And, as an extra incentive at the end of the semester I will pick the top 5 kids with the most stamps from each of my classes (I have 22 classes) and give them a certificate I printed off (from 123certificates.com) as well as choco-pie and an eraser or pencil (thank you Daiso!).  Generally, the korean students are really competitive so they like this idea of competing against each other for stuff. 

For my bad classes, I recently have had a bit of success making them sit boy/girl/boy/girl. First, I make all of them get up and the boys line up against one wall and the girls line up against another wall. And, then I hand pick how I want the students to sit boy/girl/boy/girl. I then tell them, "You act bad I will treat you like a baby and you will sit like this for the rest of the year, You behave well you can return to your old seats. Its completely your choice." And, I try to make sure I sit the really bad students in the very front so I can monitor them and control them via "the stare" which is where I stop class and stare at them until they stop acting horrible.
If they are extraordinarily bad, i.e. destroying the furniture, screaming in the middle of class, fighting, throwing pencils, throwing their shoes etc I stop class and tell them, " Push up position. Now." And, if they don't do that I then tell them, "Either you do the push up position, or I go visit the Principal right now. Its really your choice."   

Its really hard if you have a co-teacher who doesn't do anything, but generally I have found if you tell the students you will visit the VP or Principle's office its very effective.

It seems like you have a good system.  However, I try to not use the boy / girl distinction when doing seating charts.  I don't like to separate the boys and girls too much - especially given the rampant amount of sexism in Korea.  It's common practice here, just like it was in the U.S. decades ago.  My education classes taught that separating boy / girl supports an environment of girls and boys being different in the classroom...

Teachers should definitely do what best suits them; I just wanted to contribute this thought!

From my understanding, hollifina is seating them boy-girl-boy-girl, not one half only has boys and the other girls...

[Summer]

I feel like a lot of these topics/threads (student behavior related) are started by female teachers. I'm starting to wonder why. Are foreign female teachers easier targets for students? I wonder if korean female students have the same struggles.

I'm not trying to slander anyone, im just curious about the correlation.

I'm starting to lose the grip on some of my classes too, and i'm starting to give more death stares and making more classes stay after the bell. I make the whole class stay because Korea (and most of asia) has a collectivist culture, and they begin to self-govern themselves more. Also I reward the students that try to keep the class quiet.

I think women in general are typically easier targets... I'm quite worried about myself. I'm a woman, I'm Asian, I look very young, I'm quite short, and I can easily be mistaken for a student. I'm not in Korea teaching, but I am planning to do so next year and I'm very worried that I'll get no respect and won't be able to control my classes.

[Jozigirl]

I feel like a lot of these topics/threads (student behavior related) are started by female teachers. I'm starting to wonder why. Are foreign female teachers easier targets for students? I wonder if korean female students have the same struggles.

I'm not trying to slander anyone, im just curious about the correlation.

I'm starting to lose the grip on some of my classes too, and i'm starting to give more death stares and making more classes stay after the bell. I make the whole class stay because Korea (and most of asia) has a collectivist culture, and they begin to self-govern themselves more. Also I reward the students that try to keep the class quiet.

I think women in general are typically easier targets... I'm quite worried about myself. I'm a woman, I'm Asian, I look very young, I'm quite short, and I can easily be mistaken for a student. I'm not in Korea teaching, but I am planning to do so next year and I'm very worried that I'll get no respect and won't be able to control my classes.

Size has little to do with how well you can control a class of students.  One of the most feared teachers at my school is a woman of around 34 and who is only 4 ft tall.  I look very young, am quite short and was often mistaken for a student when teaching back home - it's how you approach situations and how confident you are in yourself - fake it

[Yu_Bumsuk]

I feel like a lot of these topics/threads (student behavior related) are started by female teachers. I'm starting to wonder why. Are foreign female teachers easier targets for students? I wonder if korean female students have the same struggles.

I'm not trying to slander anyone, im just curious about the correlation.

I'm starting to lose the grip on some of my classes too, and i'm starting to give more death stares and making more classes stay after the bell. I make the whole class stay because Korea (and most of asia) has a collectivist culture, and they begin to self-govern themselves more. Also I reward the students that try to keep the class quiet.

I think women in general are typically easier targets... I'm quite worried about myself. I'm a woman, I'm Asian, I look very young, I'm quite short, and I can easily be mistaken for a student. I'm not in Korea teaching, but I am planning to do so next year and I'm very worried that I'll get no respect and won't be able to control my classes.

Size has little to do with how well you can control a class of students.  One of the most feared teachers at my school is a woman of around 34 and who is only 4 ft tall.  I look very young, am quite short and was often mistaken for a student when teaching back home - it's how you approach situations and how confident you are in yourself - fake it

Today for the first time in years I had a student try to refuse to give me her phone. I finally grabbed it tightly as she held on for dear life and proceeded to walk away from her desk so that she'd end up going over the top of it if she didn't let go. I didn't get angry and kept a semi-joking attitude about the whole thing but I still made her write out double the normal amount of lines for being an idiot. Which I can do because I'm a 5'11" man and she's a 5'8" 14-year-old who may be one of the strongest in her class but still cannot out-pull me. So, I didn't have to get angry at all or ruin the atmosphere of the class or get another teacher involved or anything. There are times when it's nice not to have to be feared and send off that kind of vibe because, well, I can always just make them if they won't cooperate.

Gosh my second-years were a real handful today. Not rude but just two back-to-back lessons of 45 minutes of constant work to keep them on task.

[diane15]

[yeah i agree

if you try to give them love,
The love will come back from the Ss
eventhough it mght not work all the time.

[Yu_Bumsuk]

[yeah i agree

if you try to give them love,
The love will come back from the Ss
eventhough it mght not work all the time.

Indeed - if they know you're merely upset at their behaviour and not at them they won't hold it against you even if you do punish them for it. Basically if you're smart enough not to take it personally they won't either.

[Juicealicious]

I teach at an all girls high school and there was just a huge level of disrespect because they love to talk and use their cellphone so this is how I handled it.

For their English grade, they have a 10% participation mark which has been given to me so at the end of every class, I check to see if they've completed the assignment. They get a check mark if they do the work and an X if they don't. That pretty much made all the girls work but some were still being lazy so I upped the ante. The teachers have these yellow cards they give the students if they're bad. On the yellow card, there are different things they've done - i.e. talked back to the teacher, used their cell phones and beside it there are numbers. Basically the numbers are the points the students will lose towards their final grade, it's quite serious. So, if a student has 3 x's in my class, they receive one yellow card. If they maintain a perfect score, they'll get a green card (which, of course, is the opposite of the yellow card)

If a student receives a yellow card, it goes straight to their homeroom teacher and I have a talk with the homeroom teacher, then they speak to the student. Students seem to be very scared of the homeroom teacher. I've never had it gone beyond that, but if it does, the next step would be to send a text (Yes, a text. My school sends text messages because they believe it's better than sending home a letter) to their parents.

For me, I tried the whole reward system and it just didn't work. For my students, there had to be a real loss in their grades for them to straighten up.

I know you're in a middle school, but grades are still important, especially when they have to show their parents. I suggest talking to your co-teachers to see if there if any way you can get some of those marks or at the very least, have them use your lessons in the exams.

Sometimes these kids just get so out of control - and you shouldn't have to spend your money on rewarding these kids for behavior they should already have instilled in them.

My whole system may sound super strict, but it's the only way to get the students to do the work. Otherwise, they see your class as pointless and continue to do whatever they want.

[Janitor]

I teach at an all girls high school and there was just a huge level of disrespect because they love to talk and use their cellphone so this is how I handled it.

For their English grade, they have a 10% participation mark which has been given to me so at the end of every class, I check to see if they've completed the assignment. They get a check mark if they do the work and an X if they don't. That pretty much made all the girls work but some were still being lazy so I upped the ante. The teachers have these yellow cards they give the students if they're bad. On the yellow card, there are different things they've done - i.e. talked back to the teacher, used their cell phones and beside it there are numbers. Basically the numbers are the points the students will lose towards their final grade, it's quite serious. So, if a student has 3 x's in my class, they receive one yellow card. If they maintain a perfect score, they'll get a green card (which, of course, is the opposite of the yellow card)

If a student receives a yellow card, it goes straight to their homeroom teacher and I have a talk with the homeroom teacher, then they speak to the student. Students seem to be very scared of the homeroom teacher. I've never had it gone beyond that, but if it does, the next step would be to send a text (Yes, a text. My school sends text messages because they believe it's better than sending home a letter) to their parents.

For me, I tried the whole reward system and it just didn't work. For my students, there had to be a real loss in their grades for them to straighten up.

I know you're in a middle school, but grades are still important, especially when they have to show their parents. I suggest talking to your co-teachers to see if there if any way you can get some of those marks or at the very least, have them use your lessons in the exams.

Sometimes these kids just get so out of control - and you shouldn't have to spend your money on rewarding these kids for behavior they should already have instilled in them.

My whole system may sound super strict, but it's the only way to get the students to do the work. Otherwise, they see your class as pointless and continue to do whatever they want.

I really really like this!

My situation is that we use a lot of DVD's (of the textbooks) for support because my coteachers don't want to read the English scripts. So the students listen to the dialog and then wait for the answer to appear on the screen. It has gotten to the point where most won't listen to the recording and just wait until we finish to copy down the answers. When I tell them to do their work they tell me to put the answers on the screen.

I have tried the reward system but it failed this year. Either my students were too greedy, felt that the prize wasn't good enough, or they would pool their money and share their winnings. Now the last part doesn't seem so bad but what started happening was that they'd choose one person to do all the speaking or work and they'd eat his/her prize.

I think that this system should help at least with my kids.

[Jozigirl]

If they maintain a perfect score, they'll get a green card (which, of course, is the opposite of the yellow card)

What do they get if they get a green card?

[Juicealicious]

If they maintain a perfect score, they'll get a green card (which, of course, is the opposite of the yellow card)

What do they get if they get a green card?

The green card is just the opposite of the yellow card, so it gives them points towards their final grade. Green cards are really hard to get though, they have to be EXCEPTIONAL students so that's why they get so excited to keep a perfect score, because the green cards can give them a lot of points.

[canuck22]

I just play rough with them, verbally. Again don't let them forget you are not just a foreigner, you are a teacher as well. This one girl has always been rude to my co teacher and I. She's going to be more of a "brat" later. But once I saw her in the office with a cut knee, and when she was rude again I just asked her how her knee was. The next time I saw her, she said hello and i was like WWWWHHHHHHHHHAAAAAAAAAAAAAATTTT? Then the other day, she was with her friends and they were yelling handsome teacher at me. Now I don't care if she participated in it or not, but I definitely didn't hear any negative comments like I have before when the girls did that.

Don't retaleate per say but you have to try to be playful with it.