Dealing with student suicide(s) or attempted suicide(s)

[conorsean]

On the subject of whether suicide is cowardly, I think 'cowardliness' is much too subjective a term to be discussed objectively and therefore a pointless debate. I've had a cousin and close friend commit suicide and I still don't know exactly how I feel about it. Sometimes I'm angry with them over the state they left my/their family in, sometimes I feel intense pity for what they were going through. My own personal conclusion is that all suicide is simply a tragedy and to be judgmental about it is very harsh.   

[DejaVu]

if words alone enrage you that much, seriously you should learn some self breathing exercises or stress reduction techniques.

A person's opinion/thoughts are theirs and not everyone is going to love what another believes. you saying "you just assume they're exactly like you" is an asinine comment and is in turn you assuming you understand what another person is thinking. and in actuality your entire rant/rave whatever it is, is based off of your own notions on thinking which is your opinion/beliefs. Do i agree with your words? no, because you saying all those things is your way of trying to translate why someone said something based off of their thoughts/words, when in actuality you dont know what they are thinking.

I also love how you use chemical imbalance as a basis for your defense. Chemical imbalance is a THEORY for mental illness , that means its a conjectural status. it hasnt been PROVEN with concrete findings. being scared of life, or giving up are the results of despair and stress taking its toll on a person's will and hope. if they kill themselves because of that, well that is a coward because they gave up and took the easy way out.

if you are still enraged by my words,  well to each their own

um... "easy way out" of what? Life?

If someone doesn't enjoy life, why should they stay?  It has nothing to do with courage...

It seems that you disapprove of life and think that it should be a challenge- you may need more than just breathing  exercises.

[Yu_Bumsuk]

Death and suicide is nothing new to my life, but I have never had a student commit suicide before. I found out the other day, one of my students attempted to kill herself. At first, it didn't rattle me much, but it did bother me. It later shook me to the core, because a teacher told me her name today. She was one of my best students. She would come see me every other day and I would walk with her to the bus-stop or local places. I walked with her the day of the incident and she seemed to be doing so well.

Has anyone else been in a similar case? I find it rather hard. I know all of her friends and see them everyday. I might not even see her again and if I do, I can't even bring up anything. I have to act like nothing ever happened. I don't think I will be able to fully do that. I don't want to just bring up things, but it is hard to play dumb.

This is a troll free zone, please. Thank you.

That must be very hard indeed. I agree with those who say you should just try to treat her normally as you always have.

[anna.rpo]

Please keep on topic. This is not about your personal opinions on suicide, but how the OP is to deal with a difficult situation.

I do not have any personal anecdotes to add to this discussion, but I feel sasez has some good advice.

[Damien]

Thank you for the positive feedback. I didn't have any time to prepare and I had a rather shocking moment today in class. I was told she wasn't going to be returning to school for a while, but I guess no one gave me the "she is going to be front row in your class today" memo. I was writing something on the board and turned around to say hello. She was sitting dead center in the front row, no pun intended. I thought I had seen a ghost and turned white as a sheet. I couldn't think of anything poetic or epic, so I just said, "Long time no see. I missed you." Her face lit up and she had a huge smile. Then she said, "Me too." I was thinking, THANK GOD. I'd never have lived with myself, if I messed that one up.

I didn't let on to anything and I tried to give her the normal attention, but it was a bit hard. She always wants high-fives and wants me to shake her hand. I could sense a little tension in the class. They weren't their normal selves. Her X-best friend, part of the issue, was in that class. She use to be so sweet and nice. It seems she has turned into a little demon.

Hopefully things will get better for her and the atmosphere. Thank you for the positive feedback and staying mostly on topic.

[taeyang]

isn't it shown that people usually seem their happiest right before an attempt? because it's after they come down from that high that they get so distraught..

i cannot imagine having to deal with the outcome. i hope the OP, and anyone else who has been affected by something similar, is ok!!

[chrisinkorea2011]

if words alone enrage you that much, seriously you should learn some self breathing exercises or stress reduction techniques.

A person's opinion/thoughts are theirs and not everyone is going to love what another believes. you saying "you just assume they're exactly like you" is an asinine comment and is in turn you assuming you understand what another person is thinking. and in actuality your entire rant/rave whatever it is, is based off of your own notions on thinking which is your opinion/beliefs. Do i agree with your words? no, because you saying all those things is your way of trying to translate why someone said something based off of their thoughts/words, when in actuality you dont know what they are thinking.

I also love how you use chemical imbalance as a basis for your defense. Chemical imbalance is a THEORY for mental illness , that means its a conjectural status. it hasnt been PROVEN with concrete findings. being scared of life, or giving up are the results of despair and stress taking its toll on a person's will and hope. if they kill themselves because of that, well that is a coward because they gave up and took the easy way out.

if you are still enraged by my words,  well to each their own

um... "easy way out" of what? Life?

If someone doesn't enjoy life, why should they stay?  It has nothing to do with courage...

It seems that you disapprove of life and think that it should be a challenge- you may need more than just breathing  exercises.

why shouldnt they stay? if someone commits suicide they hurt not only themselves but also the people around them that actually care about them. THAT alone is enough reason to stay and try to live life. I dont understand where you got the concept that i dont approve of life. on the contrary i LOVE life, ive been through a lot of crap AND have had friends almost succeed in killing themselves, which is why i said what i said. I told them as well , and some got help and were fine, others truly opened their eyes and realized the pain they would have caused in their selfish choice. and you should open your eyes as well, life IS A CHALLENGE, a daily rat race. unless you had your parents feed you with a silver/golden spoon. is that the case?

[Jozigirl]

if words alone enrage you that much, seriously you should learn some self breathing exercises or stress reduction techniques.

A person's opinion/thoughts are theirs and not everyone is going to love what another believes. you saying "you just assume they're exactly like you" is an asinine comment and is in turn you assuming you understand what another person is thinking. and in actuality your entire rant/rave whatever it is, is based off of your own notions on thinking which is your opinion/beliefs. Do i agree with your words? no, because you saying all those things is your way of trying to translate why someone said something based off of their thoughts/words, when in actuality you dont know what they are thinking.

I also love how you use chemical imbalance as a basis for your defense. Chemical imbalance is a THEORY for mental illness , that means its a conjectural status. it hasnt been PROVEN with concrete findings. being scared of life, or giving up are the results of despair and stress taking its toll on a person's will and hope. if they kill themselves because of that, well that is a coward because they gave up and took the easy way out.

if you are still enraged by my words,  well to each their own

um... "easy way out" of what? Life?

If someone doesn't enjoy life, why should they stay?  It has nothing to do with courage...

It seems that you disapprove of life and think that it should be a challenge- you may need more than just breathing  exercises.

why shouldnt they stay? if someone commits suicide they hurt not only themselves but also the people around them that actually care about them. THAT alone is enough reason to stay and try to live life. I dont understand where you got the concept that i dont approve of life. on the contrary i LOVE life, ive been through a lot of crap AND have had friends almost succeed in killing themselves, which is why i said what i said. I told them as well , and some got help and were fine, others truly opened their eyes and realized the pain they would have caused in their selfish choice. and you should open your eyes as well, life IS A CHALLENGE, a daily rat race. unless you had your parents feed you with a silver/golden spoon. is that the case?

Be careful about throwing around comments like "selfish choice".  Unless you've been there, you can't possibly know what goes through a person's mind when they try to kill themself.  Some people do genuinely believe that the world would be better off without them; you can't tell them to think of all the people who care about them because for many people who reach this low point, it's hard to even think that anyone does genuinely care for them, which doesn't make the choice selfish in their view.  There are so many reasons for people to want to commit suicide and so many things that people don't know. 

[hilarity ensues]

isn't it shown that people usually seem their happiest right before an attempt? because it's after they come down from that high that they get so distraught..

I think it's because they don't really have anything left to lose and are under the impression that they're finally going to get 'relief'. Things like giving away possessions, or being really inexplicably cheerful after a long period of depression are actually warning signs... if they're distraught, then they feel like they actually have something to lose and things still have meaning.

[peasgoodnonsuch]

Just a reminder, the mods have asked us to keep this on topic, i.e. reply with direct advice to the OP's situation. This is not a thread on the rights and wrongs of suicides.

To the OP, I express my sympathies. I can't really imagine what it's like and I hope I'll never experience it. Your post has given me some pause to reflect on whether I too, am one of the negative pressures on my students. As everyone else has said, treat her as normally as possible and don't talk about it openly with anyone.

That said, if you have the chance to spend more time one on one with her, I suggest just showing her a little extra teacherly love. Whenever there's a chance encourage her feelings of self-worth or share some hope, just in a small and subtle way.

Also, you mentioned some drama with an ex-best-friend. Before writing her off as a demon, think about the scrutiny and judgement she must feel towards herself, or that may be coming from those around her. It would be very easy to feel the blame in this situation, and she may even end up being blamed by other students. With that sort of negative self-view, she may just sink lower and lower into bad behavior. I suggest that you treat her as you used to and even show her some extra-friendliness once in a while. If she's never given a chance, how can she feel sorry and reform?

This is the age where children start to form their self-identities. If they get the message "I'm a bad kid" they'll adopt it and live up to it. If they get the message "I'm worthless" that's how they'll think about themselves. I still remember how much just one good or bad word from another person could affect me at that age--especially if it came from an adult I respected. So for both of these students, I think the best thing you can do is be supportive and positive as much as you can in your interactions with them.

[Gunpo_Erin]

To the OP- I am sorry to hear about what happened with the student at your school.

I have experienced students wanting to do the same when I worked at a high school in Korea.  It sure is hard on our hearts= BUT all I can say is to keep in contact with this student. Maintain normal- chat with her(or was it a boy?).  If you see them around school, town or wherever- smile and talk.  You never know when some kind words can be extra helpful!- this goes for anybody!

Also- don't go overboard and shower the student with LOTS of extra attention- that could backfire and maybe make some students resent them? I don't know.

This sure is a tough situation to deal with anywhere! Especially in Korea!

[anna.rpo]

Hi All. Please STAY ON TOPIC. I will lock the thread if this continues. I feel this is a valuable thread otherwise as I am sure there have been and will be other posters in the same situation as the OP. I wish it wasn't the case.

[Fallon]

I used to work at a detention facility and had to deal with this many times.  Everyone copes with loss in a different way.  When students of mine used to attempt, I would wait for them to bring it up with me before we discussed it.  I tried to let my students know that if they needed to talk about anything, they could come to me.  The best advice I can give is to listen to your students and not personalize actions they may take.

[esti_strydom]

I've had a few encounters with suicide, some very close to me and some a little removed.

I think there are two things you need to consider in this situation.

1-I agree with everyone else, continue as normal. During class, do not single out this student in any way.Be as supportive as you have been in the past like walking to the bus- but do not attempt any hardcore conversation, as its a little over your head unless you have psych qualification + fluent Korean.

2- Remember, if someone succeeds in suicide, IT IS NOT YOUR FAULT. It is their decision. Ultimately you do not have control over someone else's actions. Be your wonderful teacherly self ( I think you are as you've expressed concern) and keep your chin up.

Good luck.

[sejongthefabulous]

Personally I would stay away from it.  The fact that you have a somewhat more personal relationship with this person may make it harder.  But leave it to the family, close friends and professionals.  The Korean understanding of suicide is different than the western one.  Also depression isn't the only reason for suicide.  It's not the easy way out, it's the selfish way out.

[kiekie87]

So sorry to hear about your situation.

As a previous crisis hotline counselor, I can say sometimes people are just looking for someone to listen to them. (someone unattached fromthem, a free voice) When someone is in a state of crisis they are often blindsided by any other options of living. They have tunnel vision and can only see one way out. I found a crisis hotline link for south korea.

http://www.suicide.org/hotlines/international/south-korea-suicide-hotlines.html

I suggest passing on the information to her, no directly but through her coteacher, nurse, etc, (someone who knows about the situation and wants to help her) When she has the number she will at know that there is hope out there, and she can call if she needs to.

If you have any questions, or want more information, PM me and let me know.

Take care.

[grajoker]

http://www.sacbee.com/2011/07/02/3744762/4-skoreans-missing-after-apparent.html

after reading this article i begin to see why some kids see it as an easy way out ,when the pressure of tests and exams are looming again!

[Koradian]

A first grade girl at my high school committed suicide yesterday. I'm not exactly sure as to the reasons behind it but I think we can all use this as a wake up call.

As much as we bitch and complain, we're pretty darn lucky to be in the positions we're in, have a few dollars in our pockets, have friends, and opportunities some people will never see in their lifetimes.

[kissdisap]

I'm sorry to hear that Koradian. 

You are exactly right though.  We should be thankful for the things that we have and the opportunities we've been afforded. 

Things could always be much worse....

A first grade girl at my high school committed suicide yesterday. I'm not exactly sure as to the reasons behind it but I think we can all use this as a wake up call.

As much as we bitch and complain, we're pretty darn lucky to be in the positions we're in, have a few dollars in our pockets, have friends, and opportunities some people will never see in their lifetimes.

[Yu_Bumsuk]

A first grade girl at my high school committed suicide yesterday. I'm not exactly sure as to the reasons behind it but I think we can all use this as a wake up call.

As much as we bitch and complain, we're pretty darn lucky to be in the positions we're in, have a few dollars in our pockets, have friends, and opportunities some people will never see in their lifetimes.

I'm so sorry to hear about that. The only thing I ever dread about coming into work is the knowledge that I could be faced with such news.