Author Topic: American molested 12 year old  (Read 1749 times)

Offline Frozencat99

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Re: American molested 12 year old
« Reply #40 on: January 31, 2012, 05:18:21 pm »
About rape in Korea: http://united-korea.org/code_criminal/article_0520.htm 52.1

The Korean criminal code is codified a lot differently than the one I'm used to but its freely available/accessible in English. The description of the offence (the legal definition in the country) allows either gender to be victims of rape. Though it is a lower level offence than I'd wish it to be, I'm surprised that they have a codified violation for rape within marriage.
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Offline woman-king

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Re: American molested 12 year old
« Reply #41 on: January 31, 2012, 06:00:16 pm »
About rape in Korea: http://united-korea.org/code_criminal/article_0520.htm 52.1

The Korean criminal code is codified a lot differently than the one I'm used to but its freely available/accessible in English. The description of the offence (the legal definition in the country) allows either gender to be victims of rape. Though it is a lower level offence than I'd wish it to be, I'm surprised that they have a codified violation for rape within marriage.

Interesting link, thanks for hunting that down. 

Offline woman-king

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Re: American molested 12 year old
« Reply #42 on: January 31, 2012, 06:18:27 pm »
Pardon my ignorance, but what's Korean Sentry?

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Offline woman-king

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Re: American molested 12 year old
« Reply #43 on: January 31, 2012, 06:29:57 pm »
Good points and I get what you are trying to say.  If he were denying the charges, if it looked like a potential set-up, then I'd think very differently.  The fact that he 'fessed up with such a bizarre excuse makes him sound like someone who probably shouldn't be working with kids, here or elsewhere.  I mean, I work with lots of 12-year-old Korean boys at my middle school, and regardless of how drunk I was, I would never mistake them for adults, or even high schoolers.  These are first-grade middle school students, and remember, in Western ages, 12 is actually 11 or even 10 years old in Western age--clearly pre-pubescent.  I wouldn't want someone who propositions middle-school students teaching at a middle school, even if it was done when very drunk.  But, yes, the incident doesn't seem to follow the usual trajectory of grooming the victim, so I'd be hopeful this is an isolated incident and not some kind of pattern.

I agree that he shouldn't be teaching, not that there's any risk of that ever happening again… but as for mistaking 11 year olds for legal age (19?)-- there are some pretty young-looking 19 year olds in Korea. There are boys in my middle school who are bigger than I am… in their uniforms they look younger but when I see them around town they could easily be mistaken for university students. I actually had a student last year who confessed to me that she went to dance clubs in Seoul on the weekend as well, and that she saw several foreigners who were, in her words 'verrry HANDSOME'… she was 14/15, and she still got into the clubs.

There are other questions that also need to be asked-- what was the room like? Was it completely dark? Were there other people there watching?

I'm having a really hard time believing that there isn't something being lost in translation… and how exactly could this story have been printed BEFORE they know a name? That's sort of a sign that the police have their doubts, right? If it was a place that doubles as an 'unofficial' gay sauna where random guys basically just have sex with each other all night, then the owners probably wouldn't want the papers to know that either… 

The way it's printed makes it sound like this totally unsuspiciously nameless American is claiming to have woken up around 7 in the morning, completely sober, gone looking for anonymous gay sex (in the morning???) and apparently alcohol (a gay BAR... in the morning??), and then made a conscious decision to molest a 12 year old boy, because he was smiling at him. And people actually don't think there's anything more to the story, he's definitely guilty, and he should be exposed online?

The age of consent here is 13. However sex with someone under 19 is a crime if there is any coercion, harassment, or reward associated with the sexual activity. That's why that teacher in Seoul who had sex with a 15 year old student of hers wasn't charged with anything; the lad refused to say that the sex had been anything but fully consensual. She lost her job but didn't face any civil or criminal penalties. There was another case of a man in Busan who took in a homeless teenage girl (I think she was 14 or 15). He was taken to court for having sex with her illegally but the judge ruled that the relationship was consensual and that the food and shelter he'd offered her weren't being repaid by sex.

Is it though?  Interesting blog post from Grand Narrative about this:

http://thegrandnarrative.com/2010/01/11/south-korea-age-of-consent/

Length, but interesting.

The issue with this case, to me, is that the dude confessed to it; he's not fighting it, which I would think anyone would if it were a lie.  His excuse is that he thought everyone in the place was gay, which obviously doesn't account for why he was hitting on a minor.  I suppose he could say he assumed everyone in there had to be of the age of consent to get in, I suppose,  which is why I think it makes a difference for this case if the age of consent is 19 or 13, as it specifically applies to sex between legal adults (which is 19 here, I believe) and people over the age of consent but under legal adulthood.  I'm guessing that, as in the States, two minors having sex when both are under the age of consent is treated differently than when it occurs between a minor and a legal adult (those "Romeo and Juliet"-type laws).

Offline Peekay1982

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Re: American molested 12 year old
« Reply #44 on: February 02, 2012, 09:43:28 am »
Good points and I get what you are trying to say.  If he were denying the charges, if it looked like a potential set-up, then I'd think very differently.  The fact that he 'fessed up with such a bizarre excuse makes him sound like someone who probably shouldn't be working with kids, here or elsewhere.  I mean, I work with lots of 12-year-old Korean boys at my middle school, and regardless of how drunk I was, I would never mistake them for adults, or even high schoolers.  These are first-grade middle school students, and remember, in Western ages, 12 is actually 11 or even 10 years old in Western age--clearly pre-pubescent.  I wouldn't want someone who propositions middle-school students teaching at a middle school, even if it was done when very drunk.  But, yes, the incident doesn't seem to follow the usual trajectory of grooming the victim, so I'd be hopeful this is an isolated incident and not some kind of pattern.

I agree that he shouldn't be teaching, not that there's any risk of that ever happening again… but as for mistaking 11 year olds for legal age (19?)-- there are some pretty young-looking 19 year olds in Korea. There are boys in my middle school who are bigger than I am… in their uniforms they look younger but when I see them around town they could easily be mistaken for university students. I actually had a student last year who confessed to me that she went to dance clubs in Seoul on the weekend as well, and that she saw several foreigners who were, in her words 'verrry HANDSOME'… she was 14/15, and she still got into the clubs.

There are other questions that also need to be asked-- what was the room like? Was it completely dark? Were there other people there watching?

I'm having a really hard time believing that there isn't something being lost in translation… and how exactly could this story have been printed BEFORE they know a name? That's sort of a sign that the police have their doubts, right? If it was a place that doubles as an 'unofficial' gay sauna where random guys basically just have sex with each other all night, then the owners probably wouldn't want the papers to know that either… 

The way it's printed makes it sound like this totally unsuspiciously nameless American is claiming to have woken up around 7 in the morning, completely sober, gone looking for anonymous gay sex (in the morning???) and apparently alcohol (a gay BAR... in the morning??), and then made a conscious decision to molest a 12 year old boy, because he was smiling at him. And people actually don't think there's anything more to the story, he's definitely guilty, and he should be exposed online?

The age of consent here is 13. However sex with someone under 19 is a crime if there is any coercion, harassment, or reward associated with the sexual activity. That's why that teacher in Seoul who had sex with a 15 year old student of hers wasn't charged with anything; the lad refused to say that the sex had been anything but fully consensual. She lost her job but didn't face any civil or criminal penalties. There was another case of a man in Busan who took in a homeless teenage girl (I think she was 14 or 15). He was taken to court for having sex with her illegally but the judge ruled that the relationship was consensual and that the food and shelter he'd offered her weren't being repaid by sex.

Is it though?  Interesting blog post from Grand Narrative about this:


Yes.


http://thegrandnarrative.com/2010/01/11/south-korea-age-of-consent/

Length, but interesting.

The issue with this case, to me, is that the dude confessed to it; he's not fighting it, which I would think anyone would if it were a lie.  His excuse is that he thought everyone in the place was gay, which obviously doesn't account for why he was hitting on a minor.  I suppose he could say he assumed everyone in there had to be of the age of consent to get in, I suppose,  which is why I think it makes a difference for this case if the age of consent is 19 or 13, as it specifically applies to sex between legal adults (which is 19 here, I believe) and people over the age of consent but under legal adulthood.  I'm guessing that, as in the States, two minors having sex when both are under the age of consent is treated differently than when it occurs between a minor and a legal adult (those "Romeo and Juliet"-type laws).

The age of consent here is 13 for consensual/non-coerced sex (obviously you can never consent to non-consensual sex, but you know what I mean - sex with an element of financial reward or harassment or coercion).

I imagine the middle-school student who had sex with his teacher must have faced some pretty strong pressure from his parents and the police to state that the sex took place under some sort of duress, but apparently he refused to say it was anything other than completely consensual. Possibly the text messages his mum found would have supported it being a consensual relationship. Off-topic, but I'm always astounded by these teachers who have sex with their students and expect it to remain a secret, particularly with teenage boys. What young lad wouldn't tell all his friends immediately if he'd had sex with a female teacher?

We had quite a funny scandal at my school just before the holidays. One goofy lad had a porn clip on his phone which he was charging other boys for (I'm not sure why they wouldn't just buy one copy and then send it to each other for free). He was telling them all that it was him in the clip making love to a housewife. I didn't see the clip - apparently you couldn't see the male, er, performer's face but the woman was very much an ajumma. Another boy's mum found the clip on his phone and rang the school demanding to know why sexually active 14-year-olds were filming themselves making love to middle-aged women and corrupting other children. We had quite a few sheepish boys standing in the corridor outside the staffroom for the last few days of term. I couldn't believe anyone believed it was him. When I was in middle school we'd all tell lurid tales of imaginary sexual adventures which no-one ever believed.