Re: Re: GEPIK is Finished

[tfuller]

Um... they are the employer, you are the employee?

If this happened in your home country, would it make it any different? I ton't mean to troll, but budget cuts affect every business and govt organisation. If my job is gone, it's gone. Simple as that.

[JC49]

Sorry , to hear that Shelia!!!! It's not the layoffs that is bothering me____ it's how they are handling it:

through rumors. Your cordinator  or co-teachers are not in the loop!!!! Even some of the district co-ordinators

don't have info!!!  My rant

[happytrickster]

But a contract is a contract, right?  I'm not looking for a "this is Korea" reply, but seriously, doesn't a signed contract mean anything?

[chrisinkorea2011]

I am at a loss for all the people who lost their jobs. actually at the GEPIK 2nd training enhanced crap thingy whatever it was back in june. Dain Bae was like "dont worry, u guys are fine blah blah blah" im thinking that with more time i trust her less and less. be honest and direct, dont lie to teacher's faces. I had a woman visit my school about a month ago and i found out that now my salary will come from the city and such. so i will travel between 2 schools starting next year. HOPEFULLY if my school resigns my contract that is! lol i guess my only trump card is that im a gyopo and F4 visa holder so that gives me some kind of weight. AGAIN HOPEFULLY! This woman also said my title will changed to like Language Immersion Teacher or something similar like that.

any one else recieve a visit from their city hall/funding committee?

[gilbert.a.h]

Can anyone recommend a country with a government that's not full of corrupt old fogey jerks?

I've travelled a lot and haven't seen "Narnia" but I still choose to believe that a much more just form of government than the ones we see in most countries is possible. And like you, I search for it...

There is a saying and chant in Spanish: "El pueblo unido, jamas sera vencido". Growing up in South America and now watching from the outside I've seen a huge change sweep through these last 20 years. The people are waking up to their rights, understanding their own worth, and collectively saying "no" to oppressive and unjust work practices similar to what this thread is about.  Seeing change happen in SA these last two decades helps me to feel like this world is on the right track...

Well, South Sudan might not yet be full of old fogies... It is only a couple weeks old!!!

[mellow-d]

The NET program has a lot of flaws...some NETs teach from a textbook with a curriculum, some have to make their own lessons from scratch, some do a combination. Some NETS are the primary teacher and some are not, some NETS can give grades and some cannot. it's all too disorganized. All it would have taken would have been for someone (higher up) to create a program that would have allowed the NET to teach a specific curriculum. The roles for co-teaching would be outlined and everyone would know what was expected of them. It's too bad because what I see happening is the students treat the class as a free-time class that doesn't really matter.
Another thing is that most students in Korea like to learn within the context of their own language. For example, most of the Korean teachers like to speak Korean to teach English. This method works well for Math, Science, Music....but not with language. The students never have to use the language to communicate. Another good example is a friend of mine who is taking her PhD in French in Korea. She is Korean and she says all of her classes are taught in Korean!!! I was so surprised because her classes at that level could easily be conducted in French. It really blew my mind!

[cruisemonkey]

Where's everone getting the idea it's "illegal" to be dismissed?

All they have to do is give 30 days notice and a dismissal for managerial reasons... you're gone. You could try and sue (if you can find a K lawyer stupid enough to take the case) but you'll just get laughed out of court.

It's really no different than the employee giving notice and resigning... just vice versa.

[happytrickster]

Where's everone getting the idea it's "illegal" to be dismissed?

All they have to do is give 30 days notice and a dismissal for managerial reasons... you're gone. You could try and sue (if you can find a K lawyer stupid enough to take the case) but you'll just get laughed out of court.

It's really no different than the employee giving notice and resigning... just vice versa.

It's illegal to break a contract.  And nowhere in the contract does it say that they can give you 30 days notice simply for 'managerial reasons'.  Why is everyone on the side of the Korean government?  And why would a Korean lawyer, who you racistly call a 'K', be stupid to take a case of a company breaking a legally binding contract?

[woman-king]

What a f*cking mess.

My coordinator just emailed me and said that my school is funded solely by my city, not the education office.  I'm set to renew in the fall.  Has anyone heard of city-funded schools cutting teachers?  The assumption here seems to be that they're safe, but obviously everything is up in the air.  Also, what does "contracts that are just underway" mean?  That was really ambiguously worded. 

I agree that it looks like this whole thing has been brewing for awhile.  And I agree that there are many things that could be done to change or improve the NET program in Korea.  But I also feel very strongly that this is absolutely a step backwards for the one-time "Hermit Kingdom," now so ambitious to be globally competitive.  They just won the 2018 Olympic bid.  It's just sort of shocking to me that they would take a drastic step to essentially reduce a major point of contact with the outside world like this.   

The hagwon-bribery idea seems a little far-fetched to me.  What did stand out to me though was the quote about "Korean teachers will soon be good enough to take over."  I wonder if, from a Korean perspective, having to hire foreigners in their public schools has always sort of been a "loss of face" to begin with.  I don't even know if it's about saving money so much as wanting to believe they're now at a point there they no longer need to have Waygooks running around their schools.  Anyway, rambling.

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that my city funding is solid, and also for the possibility that there will be a major outcry from parents/schools about this--especially if they try to not pay teachers/let them go before their contracts are even completed.

[peasgoodnonsuch]

Um... they are the employer, you are the employee?

If this happened in your home country, would it make it any different? I ton't mean to troll, but budget cuts affect every business and govt organisation. If my job is gone, it's gone. Simple as that.

Actually, yes. It would make a difference in my home country. I don't know where you're from, but I'm from the US and I would be able to sue not only for what I was owed, but my lawyer's fees, and any other losses due to contract breaking. It might take a long time to get it, but I'd get my money and maybe even more.

As for whether replacing NETs with KETs is about losing face, absolutely. It's also about xenophobia. In my opinion, much of Korea or at least its politicians have put on an internationally friendly face because they want money and trade deals from the other countries in the world with money, but not because they actually want to be friendly to anyone. I think they tolerate international connections and interactions in the name of making Korea great and successful, but whenever they can keep things in house they will. There's a distrust there for all things foreign and I don't see any inclination to change that. I've felt this when teaching English both from the Korean teachers and my students. They don't really care about cultural context and very little love is lost for the subject.  They just want to know English as a money-making skill and because the government has said so. If they can accomplish this without having to deal with a bunch of expensive and pesky foreigners then they will. For goodness sake, they'd rather have robots attached to Filipino webcams over us! Just so long as the Filipino's never try to actually step foot on Korean ground-they're too "poor and dirty", right?

At the end of the day, money is the only thing that matters to any government and most people.....sad sad sad.

[Epistemology]

You know....It would be an ever bigger loss of face if this got into somewhere like the New York times, especially just after Korea won the Winter Olympics.

Just saying, if anyone wants to rock the boat and  elicit retribution.

[omgitsmax]

Not really sure what to make of all of this. I talked to my district coordinator and she said that they are pretty much in the dark about it too...found out yesterday, with no official word from the Head Office.

My concern is thus...according to the article there have been 300 people who have been laid off already. Where are these 300 GEPIK teachers who are jobless right now? This is waygook...shouldn't we have seen at least a dozen "My school is cutting my contract short" threads?

Not to say that its not happeneing to people...because I have no idea and one person reported that they got the word that their contract was being cut short. It seems like for everyone else they just won't be renewed. I spoke to my coteacher (whom also hadn't heard about it) and his resonse was that #1 He hadn't heard about it at all...and that if this was something big/real that they were going to be breaking and laying off 800+ foreign teachers it would be big news even for koreans. #2 If it was going to happen they wouldn't do it int he middle of contract...and that they just wouldn't renew people.

We'll see i guess. Hard to stay motivated to prep summer camp with these materials.

[cruisemonkey]

It's illegal to break a contract.

Really? On what planet did you go to law school?

And nowhere in the contract does it say that they can give you 30 days notice simply for 'managerial reasons'.

I doesn't have to say it in the contract. It's K employment law.

Why is everyone on the side of the Korean government?

Who's on the government's side? I'm not - I'm just telling you the way it is.

And why would a Korean lawyer, who you racistly call a 'K', be stupid to take a case of a company breaking a legally binding contract?

Because he/she'd lose the case.

P.S. K is short for Korean. What's racist about calling a Korean a Korean? Don't 'read in' things that aren't there.

[dostoevsky_21_81]

My wife actually told me that it was in the Korean media.  It was just on the back pages. 

[leporello]

Christ, I just can believe that this is happening again!Talk about Groundhog day...

Last time, when they announced the budget cut in April, and 200 or something NET's had to go, that was bad enough...But 800+ jobs?.. Think of all the quality people they're going to lose by this decision...

I liked a quote from the original article, which was taken from an "anonymous official"... "As Korean Teachers  language skill's are getting better, there will be less need for native speakers at school. That's the reality"

Um, are you sure about that? I don't think I'm the only NET who's had to work with so-called "English teachers" who can't speak a damn word of English, or, if they can, teach English entirely in Korean because they're too embarrassed to speak it in front of the students ...Sure there are some competent speakers here, and I'm guessing that the level of  the KT's English may have gone up slightly in the last few years, but I think for the most part we're still of good use in the classroom...Well, good luck to the K's... If they want their kid's speaking Englishee instead of English, that's their call..

I don't know about my job... I guess I'm like everyone else, waiting to see what happens, and crossing my fingers in the meantime...The one thing I do know is that this constant uncertainty sours Korea for me... And don't talk to me about Hagwon's  or the countryside, since I've done that before, and no thanks, not again... If I do get out of this with my hide unscathed, I'm going back to New Zealand at the finish of my contract and not looking back...

Everyone else, best of luck... I think a lot of us are going to need it...

[happytrickster]

It's illegal to break a contract.

Really? On what planet did you go to law school?

And nowhere in the contract does it say that they can give you 30 days notice simply for 'managerial reasons'.

I doesn't have to say it in the contract. It's K employment law.

Why is everyone on the side of the Korean government?

Who's on the government's side? I'm not - I'm just telling you the way it is.

And why would a Korean lawyer, who you racistly call a 'K', be stupid to take a case of a company breaking a legally binding contract?

Because he/she'd lose the case.

P.S. K is short for Korean. What's racist about calling a Korean a Korean? Don't 'read in' things that aren't there.

You're right, Jap is short for Japanese person, that's not racist.  Breaking a contract is a big deal, ever a verbal contract is binding, if you have a written contract it's pretty binding dude.

[peasgoodnonsuch]

It's illegal to break a contract.

Really? On what planet did you go to law school

On what planet did you? Are you an International or Korean lawyer? If not, I don't understand why you feel you can take such an arrogant tone towards other people's comments. It's unclear right now what kind of legal recourse NETs have a right to under Korean law. However, it is standard that written contracts are legally binding. That's why entire courses in law school are devoted to contract law.

[justanotherwaygook]

Great bickering folks!  Keep it up!

In the words of our mods:

"Please stay on topic."

[Burndog]

actually at the GEPIK 2nd training enhanced crap thingy whatever it was back in june. Dain Bae was like "dont worry, u guys are fine blah blah blah" im thinking that with more time i trust her less and less. be honest and direct, dont lie to teacher's faces.

How is this GEPIK's fault? The funding cut has come out of the blue from the body above the body above GEPIK!!! Blaming GEPIK for this decision is like blaming one of your students because your Principal did something wrong!

[Yu_Bumsuk]

I find it hard to believe they'd ax an entire programme just like that. What about the GEPIK HQ employees? Some of the lower-downs would be on contracts just like us but there also must be a log of higher-ups who have tenured jobs with the province. What will happen to them?

The parents won't be too happy - probably not in that many cases because they believe NETs are teaching their kids so much, but because kids out in the sticks are getting NETs but their kids aren't. Wow, they must live in such a poor and / or badly managed province.