Author Topic: Spoiled, demanding kids. How should I tweak my reward system? (Read 2032 times)

Brennand · « **on:** August 26, 2015, 04:04:36 PM »

Hi all.

For the past year and a half I've been using a raffle-type reward system with my 1st and 2nd graders. It's worked pretty well up until now. I just keep a tally on the board of how many tickets they are earning and then hand out raffle tickets accordingly at the end of class for them to write their names on and put in a jar to be drawn every 3 weeks or so to get a prize.

It has worked fairly well because it has been the only system that I have been able to keep rather consistent in my rewards and punishments as well as making it very obvious to students how their behaviour affects their chances of getting prizes.

The problem I'm having now (mostly with 1st graders) is that the students are just spoiled brats and when it's time to do the draw and give out prizes, the students who don't win get super demanding. These kids simply haven't learned that they can't win every single time. So I've come to dread giving prizes because it usually ends with students taking it very personally when they don't win, and me getting called nasty names in Korean. Students cry, scream, you name it. Although I'm not delusional enough to think I can change this kind of attitude, I don't think that giving out rewards despite such rudeness is sending the right message either.

So now I'm looking for ideas for other reward systems. I know this topic has been beat to death but I'm specifically looking for ways to tweak what I already have since I just haven't had the same success with any other systems I've tried.

I was thinking about replacing the prizes with the a 'class president' sort of reward where the winner would be able to choose the song/dance/video for the start of the class. The problem with this however is that I could see interest in the reward system quickly dwindling if the same students (the ones who behave and study well) were the only ones ever winning.

What do you think? All suggestions welcome! ^^ thanks!

MartinBrez · « **Reply #1 on:** August 27, 2015, 11:02:39 AM »

I usually give out a small piece of candy to each student who is sat behaved unannounced. I just walk by their desks and give it to them without saying anything.

The kids who are being little a-holes, whine a little at first. But, when I point to the students who are behaved with candy, the a-hole students realise that they have to behave more.

I don't do this for every class as the bad students would expect it every time. It works for me, but depends on how whiny and spoilt your students are.

One thing I hate about Korean kids is how spoilt they are. It annoys me that my school would always pander to them.

If kids throw tantrums or hissy fits at me, I just laugh at them. Cry me a f***ing river!

janet1992 · « **Reply #2 on:** August 27, 2015, 04:23:11 PM »

I have had similar issues with the younger kids and it is very frustrating when they scream and cry like little brats, totally irks me!

I have started using stickers instead and everyone gets one if they have a) completed the work, b) done it well. I give 2 stickers for excellent work. (This is when I can see they have really given a good effort. )

Now, I have bought some pretty cool stickers - you can get scented stickers from What The Book. And if we aren't doing a worksheet or paper involved activity I give them the stickers by cutting them out of the sticker sheet - they love this, then they can stick them on their books and such. Plus I hate giving candy, it gets costly and they don't always deserve it.

I has been a much better way to reward them and the 2 stickers for high level work (like, if it's more tidy handwriting and time taken care) really works, they get competitive to do better. And the 1 sticker prevents bullying from other students if one got rewarded and the other didn't ...

however, this is just what has worked for me recently... I hope you can try this out or find a better way. Hapyp teaching!

melbell · « **Reply #3 on:** August 27, 2015, 05:16:56 PM »

Quote from: janet1992 on August 27, 2015, 04:23:11 PM

I have had similar issues with the younger kids and it is very frustrating when they scream and cry like little brats, totally irks me!

I have started using stickers instead and everyone gets one if they have a) completed the work, b) done it well. I give 2 stickers for excellent work. (This is when I can see they have really given a good effort. )

Now, I have bought some pretty cool stickers - you can get scented stickers from What The Book. And if we aren't doing a worksheet or paper involved activity I give them the stickers by cutting them out of the sticker sheet - they love this, then they can stick them on their books and such. Plus I hate giving candy, it gets costly and they don't always deserve it.

I has been a much better way to reward them and the 2 stickers for high level work (like, if it's more tidy handwriting and time taken care) really works, they get competitive to do better. And the 1 sticker prevents bullying from other students if one got rewarded and the other didn't ...

however, this is just what has worked for me recently... I hope you can try this out or find a better way. Hapyp teaching!

So do you give rewards for having a certain amount of stickers or are the stickers seen as rewards?

janet1992 · « **Reply #4 on:** September 02, 2015, 11:07:05 AM »

Quote

So do you give rewards for having a certain amount of stickers or are the stickers seen as rewards?

Stickers are the rewards at my small schools. That's it, that's all.

At my main school, (big school) we have a school wide system that we use with my "star chart" . On the star chart if they get 10 stars they can get a school market "coupon" where the school has a little market place (glass cupboard with a bunch of cheap toys and stationary) and one coupon can buy them one of those items.

I blogged about it once: http://mrsbaiasclassroom.blogspot.kr/2014/05/class-management-idea-star-chart-and.html

pkjh · « **Reply #5 on:** September 02, 2015, 12:00:57 PM »

Don't reward them.

stuman · « **Reply #6 on:** September 02, 2015, 12:04:43 PM »

Maybe have a "store." Students can earn tickets, and give turn them in for a price.

cephas · « **Reply #7 on:** September 03, 2015, 03:50:14 PM »

I've had success with this reward system in every class, grades 1-4. Here's how it works:

1. Draw a staircase with 25 levels on a piece of paper (I just used a piece of white office paper. Nothing fancy.)
2. Mark every fifth stair to show it's special. (So stairs 5, 10, 15, 20, and 25 will be marked).
3. Every time students reach one of the marked stairs, the class receives a prize. The prizes get better and better as they advance further. Prize examples: 5 = a small piece of candy, 10 = going to the playground for a game, 15 = a nicer piece of candy, 20 = a special computer game/bomb game, 25 = a class party (we just took one class to watch Mr. Bean, eat some snack chips, drink some cola, and play one of their favorite English games).
4. Every time students misbehave, I put a black magnet beneath their staircase paper. Three black magnets means they can't advance a stair. Six black magnets means they are going backwards. Two or one or zero black magnets means they advance one stair.
5. I also give out yellow magnets to reward good behavior and good English. Three yellow magnets will advance them an extra stair. I'm very stingy with yellow magnets.
6. I count down 3, 2, 1 in English if I want absolute silence in the class. Failure for the class to become absolutely quiet and paying attention to me can warrant a black magnet, although sometimes it's good to be merciful

This system isn't perfect, but it works well enough. Students are always thrilled when I bring in candy or they reach the 25th stair and I bring in treats and we watch Sponge Bob or Mr. Bean. It's also very low maintenance. It requires almost no upkeep on your part, just a little money to purchase candy and snacks (it's worth the peace of mind

).

Hope this helps! Send me a message if you'd like more clarification. A good discipline system is key.

EDIT: I just want to point out that one of the strengths of this system is peer correction. Students will get angry with other students who misbehave because it affects the entire class. Everyone gets rewarded, but bad behavior hurts everyone. Students will help you discipline.

amgoalng · « **Reply #8 on:** September 03, 2015, 05:36:37 PM »

First,
I already see a problem with your system. Just because you increase the chances of getting a prize, it doesn't mean the good students will get the prize. You can have one little brat whose name is in there only once get a prize while your best student gets nothing. You aren't really reawarding good behavior.

I did a similar thing with my middle school students once. It doesn't work from my experince.

Second,
I know exactly what you mean. Last year I had grades one and two. I would give a small piece of candy if the students did all their work and participated. They always demanded more. I gave one candy, they asked for two. I gave two, they demanded three, and etc.

The reward system can really bite you on the butt if you aren't careful because the students can get real spoiled real quick.

Also, remember, grades 1 and 2 are the hardest grades to teach. Koreans have told me this.

You are not alone, we have all experince what you are going through.

My advice is this.
1. Get rid of the random crap. It never works and can create resentment.
2. Let the good student always get the good stuff. Maybe then the bad students will wise up and realize they aren't getting anything. Let the brats suffer because they won't shut up!
3. Keep the prizes to be candy or stickers but make it only the top half of the class. If the candy is small, give it out only once every two weeks. If you really want the bratty kids to suffer, give candy once a month, but make the prize worth having.
4. Keep the name thing, but have a line that basically shows, "These kids get candy, these kids don't." If they want to get mad, let them, but at least you are rewarding good behavior.

westwoods · « **Reply #9 on:** September 04, 2015, 02:39:39 AM »

I do the random raffle ticket thing too, but I give candy. Super cheap candy. They're still always excited about it. I give out about 10-15 candies for each class of 25-28 kids. When most of the kids win a prize there's few who can complain and the kids who don't win usually know exactly why- because they only had 0-2 tickets or something. Of course every now and then there's that one kid who's like "Teacher, I 19 ticket! No candy! Whhhhyyyyyy?"
But it's never really a problem, they usually just want me to commiserate with them, so I just say "Awww sorry, bad luck!"

Brennand · « **Reply #10 on:** September 04, 2015, 02:53:01 PM »

Thanks for the replies everyone! Very helpful and inspirational.

I tried something a little new, mostly based on what Janet said. A couple classes ago I got so fed up with the grade 1s saying they hated me in Korean that I through the whole jar of tickets into the garbage in front of them and told them no more prizes. The next class, I still tallied their 'tickets' and gave stickers when they completed their little projects. The stickers went over well although I did sense the winds of entitlement beginning to blow.

As for the tally marks I used it to determine who could choose the starting videos for next class. This went over like a lead balloon, and when the chance came for them to choose videos it was a disaster (as you probably could have assumed). I didn't plan enough and I had 3 students (out of 5) who were eligible to choose videos. They wanted to pick random videos from the youtube homepage which is mostly filled with English kids songs etc. but of course one girl was determined to pick the video of some nerd playing minecraft for 20 minutes. I had already told them not to choose it but she ran up to the computer and repeatedly clicked it no matter how stern I got. Finally I was able to push her to the side and put on a dancing video that everyone else wanted to watch. Needless to say she was upset and didn't participate for the rest of the class.

I've been teaching at this school for almost 3 years and I still suck at dealing with these classes. I'm really just not made for teaching little kids I think. I need to have some (simple) way to give and take away rewards to individual students (or some other way of disciplining them) or else there is just no control whatsoever. I dread every day that I have to teach these brats. And that's terrible because I like pretty much everything else about my job and life right now.

Brennand · « **Reply #11 on:** September 04, 2015, 03:23:03 PM »

I must also say that although I like the ideas of sticker boards / reward staircases etc. I am miserable and keeping to them and as such the students don't see them as important indicators of how their behaviour affects the class.

How about this: I keep tallies like usual. Kids with more than 5 points at the end of class, or students who do good work on their projects/worksheets get a sticker. If the total points for the class are over 20...or maybe 25 (there are 5 students in the class) they can choose a game or video or dance at the end.

How do you think that might go over?

Eros · « **Reply #12 on:** September 04, 2015, 03:53:57 PM »

Learning is its own reward.

I must say the lottery system seems bad because it's like, 'you all can win, but chance decides.' Which inevitably will lead to disappointment. A better approach might be to give stamps or stickers, and the student with the most gets a prize. That way, you remove the aspect of chance. It's more likely to avoid disappointment.

Aristocrat · « **Reply #13 on:** September 08, 2015, 10:56:18 AM »

Kids here CAN learn the exception to the rule. Before my CT left for training and my schedule changed so I had to teach 4th graders for the first time alone, I was warned that the 4th grade students are especially bad to all the teachers. I dreaded teaching them alone for the next three months.

First class, they tried acting up and I didn't give them the time of day. I quickly showed them my reward and punishment system. I was very stern and 3 students were made to write out lines
(존경 X 50 and 'respect' X 50). By far the rule I was strictest with was no talking without raising your hand first and getting permission. It might seem harsh, but it works. It's much easier to tone it down later than to get tougher.

Now, the students are very easy to control, since the Korean teachers approach was to coddle and 'nurture' them to shut the f*ck up.

Brennand · « **Reply #14 on:** September 08, 2015, 12:31:48 PM »

Quote from: Aristocrat on September 08, 2015, 10:56:18 AM

Kids here CAN learn the exception to the rule. Before my CT left for training and my schedule changed so I had to teach 4th graders for the first time alone, I was warned that the 4th grade students are especially bad to all the teachers. I dreaded teaching them alone for the next three months.

First class, they tried acting up and I didn't give them the time of day. I quickly showed them my reward and punishment system. I was very stern and 3 students were made to write out lines
(존경 X 50 and 'respect' X 50). By far the rule I was strictest with was no talking without raising your hand first and getting permission. It might seem harsh, but it works. It's much easier to tone it down later than to get tougher.

Now, the students are very easy to control, since the Korean teachers approach was to coddle and 'nurture' them to shut the f*ck up.

This is great! I don't think it'll work with my grade 1s and 2s since they can't write words yet, but I have a grade 5 class that I definitely need to get tough with. Writing lines was something I was toying with. Hopefully I'm not too late to start being tough with them and making them write lines every time they speak without raising their hand. One kid is especially disrespectful and refused to leave the class when everyone had just had enough of him.

Clarebot · « **Reply #15 on:** September 08, 2015, 01:17:26 PM »

I think lotteries can be good but the problem is a lot of it is down to chance so even if a kid works extremely hard, they might not get anything and they will feel resentful then, which could lead to them not bothering.

I used to use stickers but switched to pretend dollars which I made on this site http://www.festisite.com/money/. I find it works really well because the rewards they earn are directly proportionate to how hard the work in class.

I give dollars out for demonstrating in class, winning games, answering a hard question, doing something kind, cleaning the board, sweeping the floor etc. I am never short of volunteers to help me with stuff now.

I bought some clear hanging pockets in Daiso and put stickers with amounts on them, from $4 to $10. $4 would be something very small like an eraser or a badge, $10 would be something like stickers or a phone charm. So they can come up and look at the pockets and decide what to buy, without me needing to tell them how much stuff is.

Because I have over 600 students I have to make things quite expensive. Like most students would take about a month just to earn a Chocopie ($7). It totally does work though and I don't have to spend that much money because I get my family and friends in Ireland to send over cheap little souvenirs and chocolate and stuff for my supply. But when I do have to buy stuff, I never spend more than 10,000W and if I spend that much it goes in the $10 pocket.

Here are some more reasons I like using pretend money:

1) I don't have to go all the way down to their seat to give it, if they demo at the top of class I can hand it to them then
2) Students can pool their money to buy things together and they often do.
3) They're more fun than stamps. I've made a big variety of k-pop stars and characters, and part of the fun is seeing who they'll get and swapping around the ones they like.
4) They're using vocab in English like 'I would like to buy ~', 'Here's $6' and sometimes they will even try 'Teacher, discount please, very expensive!'

Anyway good luck with it!

tamjen · « **Reply #16 on:** September 08, 2015, 07:19:36 PM »

Here's a suggestion, stop rewarding them.

I seriously do not understand the whole reward thing here. I don't do it. I never have. I never will. I didn't get rewarded for going to school, listening and learning. That's what I was supposed to do.

It's a vicious circle that once you are in it, you'll find it nearly impossible to get out of.

It's like rewarding a taxi driver for getting you from A to B alive. That's his job! A student's job - and it's the easiest job any of them will ever have - is to pay attention in class. Rewards are not necessary and in my opinion fundamentally wrong with the wrong message being sent.

Clarebot · « **Reply #17 on:** September 08, 2015, 08:26:01 PM »

Quote from: tamjen on September 08, 2015, 07:19:36 PM

Here's a suggestion, stop rewarding them.

I seriously do not understand the whole reward thing here. I don't do it. I never have. I never will. I didn't get rewarded for going to school, listening and learning. That's what I was supposed to do.

It's a vicious circle that once you are in it, you'll find it nearly impossible to get out of.

It's like rewarding a taxi driver for getting you from A to B alive. That's his job! A student's job - and it's the easiest job any of them will ever have - is to pay attention in class. Rewards are not necessary and in my opinion fundamentally wrong with the wrong message being sent.

That's all well and good if it's easy to intrinsically motivated your students. But when you're teaching Korean kids, who are overworked and taught to focus entirely on grades, it's not easy. I teach middle school and my life was a lot harder before I implemented my system. Getting the kids to participate was like pulling teeth.

You're up against so much - teaching classes of 30+ with mixed abilities, students whose language you can't speak, in a class they're not going to be tested on, when they're embarrassed and afraid to make mistakes because of how they're treated by other teachers, not to mention completely exhausted. In the beginning I had so many problems - students refusing to do any work, just ignoring me, chatting, coming in really late. All those problems have been massively reduced by using external motivators. As a class they collect plus points when they behave right and minus ones when they don't, and nobody wants to let their whole class down by getting minus points. I reward them with a game or a music video once they reach certain milestones. And the pretend dollars of course.

I didn't get rewarded in school either but I also wasn't put through an education system that fosters a resentment of learning. I think it's great if you can have good classes without any reward system but in my school, with my students, it's essential. The other option is to be a hard-ass and use a lot of punishments, but that conflicts with what the class is supposed to be like - fun, easy going, a break from all the crap they're put through every day.

Brennand · « **Reply #18 on:** September 11, 2015, 01:46:10 PM »

Quote from: Clarebot on September 08, 2015, 01:17:26 PM

I think lotteries can be good but the problem is a lot of it is down to chance so even if a kid works extremely hard, they might not get anything and they will feel resentful then, which could lead to them not bothering.

I used to use stickers but switched to pretend dollars which I made on this site http://www.festisite.com/money/. I find it works really well because the rewards they earn are directly proportionate to how hard the work in class.

I give dollars out for demonstrating in class, winning games, answering a hard question, doing something kind, cleaning the board, sweeping the floor etc. I am never short of volunteers to help me with stuff now.

I bought some clear hanging pockets in Daiso and put stickers with amounts on them, from $4 to $10. $4 would be something very small like an eraser or a badge, $10 would be something like stickers or a phone charm. So they can come up and look at the pockets and decide what to buy, without me needing to tell them how much stuff is.

Because I have over 600 students I have to make things quite expensive. Like most students would take about a month just to earn a Chocopie ($7). It totally does work though and I don't have to spend that much money because I get my family and friends in Ireland to send over cheap little souvenirs and chocolate and stuff for my supply. But when I do have to buy stuff, I never spend more than 10,000W and if I spend that much it goes in the $10 pocket.

Here are some more reasons I like using pretend money:

1) I don't have to go all the way down to their seat to give it, if they demo at the top of class I can hand it to them then
2) Students can pool their money to buy things together and they often do.
3) They're more fun than stamps. I've made a big variety of k-pop stars and characters, and part of the fun is seeing who they'll get and swapping around the ones they like.
4) They're using vocab in English like 'I would like to buy ~', 'Here's $6' and sometimes they will even try 'Teacher, discount please, very expensive!'

Anyway good luck with it!

This is also great! I was thinking of implementing a currency system for my grade 3 and 4 afterschool classes. They are generally very enthusiastic and work very hard and I haven't been rewarding them with anything because I generally don't need to. However, they recently decided (on their own) that English class should be English only. I was super proud of them but all I had to offer them for speaking only English the entire class was stickers. They were very happy with that, but it made me remember when I was in grade 3 (French immersion) and our teacher had a money system in place. We would start out with a certain amount of money at the beginning of the month and if we were caught speaking English or speaking French incorrectly we had to pay a 'dollar'. I can't remember what we could do with the dollars, but I remember it being a very crucial issue in our daily lives. We all probably spoke more French that year than in any other year.

Clarebot: Would you be able to share a picture of the clear hanging pockets? I'm having trouble visualizing the size of the pockets. Also, do you charge 'money' if students commit infractions? (speaking English, fooling around, etc.) And how often do the students get to 'go shopping'?

janet1992 · « **Reply #19 on:** September 15, 2015, 01:33:31 PM »

Quote from: Brennand on September 04, 2015, 02:53:01 PM

I've been teaching at this school for almost 3 years and I still suck at dealing with these classes. I'm really just not made for teaching little kids I think. I need to have some (simple) way to give and take away rewards to individual students (or some other way of disciplining them) or else there is just no control whatsoever. I dread every day that I have to teach these brats. And that's terrible because I like pretty much everything else about my job and life right now.

Honestly, I hear you! My grade 1 and 2 class - I dread every week , I only have it once a week but it can be a nightmare. A constant hit and miss. I try to plan it as much as possible and I have learnt which may have seemed obvious, I know, but I still had to learn it, that the kids will work better the more activities you plan and have. So now, in a span of 40 minutes I do at least 4 activities. I have found, the more I have to offer and distract them with - the more they are better behaved - and then no rewards necessary. Time actually flies too! Plus, if something is not working - move to the next thing planned. Saves you the drama of trying to get through an activity that just isn't working with them.

I agree with someone on here saying " The reward is learning" however - some days the kids are not motivated at all and the only way to get them going is a promise of a star on my star chart - it doesn't happen all the time and not with every class but it does happen and esp with low level unmotivated kids - that NEED to speak more in class , so I'll offer rewards to get them participating. This to me, is not so much a behavior issue as some kids are happy to be well behaved but stay quiet and not participate in any of the speaking activities in the lesson. So they can fall under the teacher's radar that way.

BUT, bad behavior - I don't reward for a second and now, what has become quite effective esp with my grade 5 and 6 , is cleaning my classroom during the 10 min interval after and between classes. I make them stay and sweep or wash my desk tops with wet tissues/cloth and spray and I am nagging them at every moment to get them cleaning every spot. They HATE IT. But so far, behavior has really improved BUT again, I can't do this with the young young ones (1s and 2s) or the Korean teachers will FREAK> they are truly babied! So I understand OP's woes... just focus on planning great lessons that fly by so they don't notice rewards not being given - they're too busy moving to the next challenge. That's the target I've set myself with the young ones. I have no CT when I am with them, so it can be very challenging some days. I blog about my lessons that have gone well - but some have NOT gone well, trust me - I am not made for the littlest ones - at least not left alone.

Good luck!

Author Topic: Spoiled, demanding kids. How should I tweak my reward system? (Read 2032 times)

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