Author Topic: The 7 major English speaking countries. (Read 18739 times)

Yu_Bumsuk · « **Reply #40 on:** April 06, 2011, 10:50:03 AM »

Quote from: kershea on April 06, 2011, 12:01:27 AM

About South Africa....the 'rainbow nation'

Most Indians in South Africa (about 2 million) have been there for many generations and only ever speak English. Most don't even know any Indian languages... So, they're native language speakers as far as being educated within a British system and only speaking English as a home language.
Most Afrikaans speakers speak native level English.
Most university educated people in SA have native level English ability,whatever their background...
We all have variations in our accent and pronunciation though.(sometimes depending on province,much like in the Uk and USA where accents vary).
We also study standard British spelling and pronunciation at school, which sometimes confuses the kids if they've had an American or Canadian teacher...

I've met a few South Africans and Canadians teaching in Korea I would not consider native speakers. I've also met a few Korean-Americans I wouldn't call native speakers, even if they did have a US passport. It's inevitable that a few will slip through the cracks, but the current standards are probably the best possible.

DMZ · « **Reply #41 on:** April 06, 2011, 10:59:29 AM »

Quote from: Yu_Bumsuk on April 06, 2011, 10:50:03 AM

Quote from: kershea on April 06, 2011, 12:01:27 AM
About South Africa....the 'rainbow nation'

Most Indians in South Africa (about 2 million) have been there for many generations and only ever speak English. Most don't even know any Indian languages... So, they're native language speakers as far as being educated within a British system and only speaking English as a home language.
Most Afrikaans speakers speak native level English.
Most university educated people in SA have native level English ability,whatever their background...
We all have variations in our accent and pronunciation though.(sometimes depending on province,much like in the Uk and USA where accents vary).
We also study standard British spelling and pronunciation at school, which sometimes confuses the kids if they've had an American or Canadian teacher...

I've met a few South Africans and Canadians teaching in Korea I would not consider native speakers. I've also met a few Korean-Americans I wouldn't call native speakers, even if they did have a US passport. It's inevitable that a few will slip through the cracks, but the current standards are probably the best possible.

I'm not sure you could say they "slipped through the cracks" especially in the public school system, given that they would have had a telephone interview to guage their proficiency and that they have degrees completed in English. They're probably better English speakers than most uneducated native speakers.

Vincent · « **Reply #42 on:** April 06, 2011, 11:09:21 AM »

Quote from: eemneedah on April 06, 2011, 10:22:08 AM

The point of what I'm saying is that English is the lingua franca of South Africa

My boyfriend is Irish and went to an Irish speaking primary school and wasn't taught in English until he went to secondary school.

So let's just all calm down to a mild panic shall we?
[/quote]

I'm Irish too, and I'd say my first, native language is Irish (or my mother would beat me) - my most commonly used language is English however and I'd be more proficient in English by comparison due to simple things like practice and levels of input.

Although my posts don't seem to reflect this :D

adamwatch · « **Reply #43 on:** April 06, 2011, 11:19:55 AM »

Are Americans native speakers? Given that they don't have English as their official langauge? Just a thought

Adam

adamwatch · « **Reply #44 on:** April 06, 2011, 11:22:42 AM »

"but the current standards are probably the best possible"

***By standards you mean a degree in anything and a passport from certain select countries! Some standards.!

Adam.

dwebsterlfc · « **Reply #45 on:** April 06, 2011, 01:03:06 PM »

This isn't even a thread to debate what countries speak what languages. It was just a few lessons compiled together for if somebody wanted to use them.

I used the term main because that's who the students will most likely be meeting if they bump in to people in bars, malls etc in Korea.

Also the post about... in America we eat all kinds of food.... of course you do, I'm not saying that these are the only foods served in America, I'm saying that these are heavily associated with America... I understand that pizza is Italian but the thick based pizza were American weren't they? That's what I've always believed.... I've been wrong before, and I'll be wrong again but if there's anything you don't agree with in the PPT's just modify it to suit your needs.

They're just a base to use.

Yu_Bumsuk · « **Reply #46 on:** April 06, 2011, 01:15:34 PM »

Quote from: DMZ on April 06, 2011, 10:59:29 AM

I'm not sure you could say they "slipped through the cracks" especially in the public school system, given that they would have had a telephone interview to guage their proficiency and that they have degrees completed in English. They're probably better English speakers than most uneducated native speakers.

'I just got back from Daegu'.

'Oh, is it'?

I don't know if I'd call that better than most uneducated native speakers.

shea.karssing · « **Reply #47 on:** April 06, 2011, 01:31:06 PM »

Maybe I'm belabouring the point you're trying to make..but I'm a native English speaker from SA and I say "Is it?" all the time! It's just a manner of speaking akin to many American/Canadian/British/Irish/wherever! expressions that also may not be grammatically perfect, but are used all the time..maybe just not in your PPTS.

Yu_Bumsuk · « **Reply #48 on:** April 06, 2011, 01:34:19 PM »

Quote from: adamwatch on April 06, 2011, 11:22:42 AM

"but the current standards are probably the best possible"

***By standards you mean a degree in anything and a passport from certain select countries! Some standards.!

Adam.

It's a lousy standard but what else can one use apart from an interview with a panel of native speakers. For instance, say two Koreans moved to the US when they were 15 years old. Eight years later they both have citizenship and degrees. One can write at a high academic level and fool any other American over the phone that he was born there. The other still has a noticeable accent and needed his friends to edit his papers because he still gets articles and prepositions wrong. Both are eligible to teach in Korea as NETs but one is obviously not fully qualified to teach writing or phonics, two of the things that are part of the reason for hiring NETs in the first place. Again, short of interviews by NETs there's not much else you could do, and even that would be very inconsistant.

adamwatch · « **Reply #49 on:** April 06, 2011, 01:49:57 PM »

Many people from say Africa have excellent English but will not be able to get a job here. I think their English should be the test not their nationality. Also a degree is certainly not needed given the level of English here.

Adam

DMZ · « **Reply #50 on:** April 06, 2011, 01:53:53 PM »

Quote from: Yu_Bumsuk on April 06, 2011, 01:15:34 PM

Quote from: DMZ on April 06, 2011, 10:59:29 AM
I'm not sure you could say they "slipped through the cracks" especially in the public school system, given that they would have had a telephone interview to guage their proficiency and that they have degrees completed in English. They're probably better English speakers than most uneducated native speakers.

'I just got back from Daegu'.

'Oh, is it'?

I don't know if I'd call that better than most uneducated native speakers.

That's slang! And of course we don't teach that to the students. I'm sorry you don't understand it but South Africans understand it perfectly just like "ja well no fine" makes sense to us.... Again, we don't teach it to the students. I would imagine that Americans also don't teach their students to say "like, totally".

Yu_Bumsuk · « **Reply #51 on:** April 06, 2011, 02:07:17 PM »

Quote from: DMZ on April 06, 2011, 01:53:53 PM

Quote from: Yu_Bumsuk on April 06, 2011, 01:15:34 PM
Quote from: DMZ on April 06, 2011, 10:59:29 AM
I'm not sure you could say they "slipped through the cracks" especially in the public school system, given that they would have had a telephone interview to guage their proficiency and that they have degrees completed in English. They're probably better English speakers than most uneducated native speakers.

'I just got back from Daegu'.

'Oh, is it'?

I don't know if I'd call that better than most uneducated native speakers.
That's slang! And of course we don't teach that to the students. I'm sorry you don't understand it but South Africans understand it perfectly just like "ja well no fine" makes sense to us.... Again, we don't teach it to the students. I would imagine that Americans also don't teach their students to say "like, totally".

All right, but with regard to the teacher I was thinking of, if I met him at an airport I'd assume he was an educated Indian. He was actually an elementary school teacher back in SA.

Yu_Bumsuk · « **Reply #52 on:** April 06, 2011, 02:11:25 PM »

Quote from: adamwatch on April 06, 2011, 01:49:57 PM

Many people from say Africa have excellent English but will not be able to get a job here. I think their English should be the test not their nationality. Also a degree is certainly not needed given the level of English here.

Adam

I know this has been debated endlessly, but a degree does at least show some level of academic commitment and success. Yes, there are people with degrees who can't write grammatically and who communicate very poorly, but letting non-degree holders teach here would certainly do nothing to improve the quality of teaching.

adamwatch · « **Reply #53 on:** April 06, 2011, 03:33:10 PM »

"I know this has been debated endlessly, but a degree does at least show some level of academic commitment and success".

**A degree can just mean you were too lazy to get a job and you could afford the fees. It has nothing to do with teaching in most cases.

Adam

dwebsterlfc · « **Reply #54 on:** April 06, 2011, 03:45:30 PM »

Quote from: adamwatch on April 06, 2011, 03:33:10 PM

"I know this has been debated endlessly, but a degree does at least show some level of academic commitment and success".

**A degree can just mean you were too lazy to get a job and you could afford the fees. It has nothing to do with teaching in most cases.

Adam

Lol you have to play devils advocate on every post.

It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with teaching, correct, but it does mean that you must have written essays/coursework with a proficient level of English.

kleigh · « **Reply #55 on:** April 06, 2011, 11:34:19 PM »

"is it" is commonly used in place of "is that so"... It's used informally ... Much like the "You did good" I often hear American native speakers use,in place of you did well. It's incorrect grammar, but its just a colloquialism that's been used so often people don't even think about what they're saying. You're right, there are people who "slip through the cracks", and who wouldn't have a high enough level of grammar proficiency to teach academic English in their home country, but whose abilities are sufficient for the purposes here... If the Korean govt only wanted the kids to learn American English ,expressions and accent, then why not only employ Americans....Anyway,from what I've seen and heard you're definitely at the top of their preference list ;) but I suppose there's not enough US teachers to fill the spaces... Anyone detect a hint of bitterness lol? (I'm from SA, and I'm what you'd call 'Indian'... So I feel the constant, unnecessary need to defend my native speaker status,especially since I'm not wonderfully wh... ). *sorry to ramble on*

boosh77 · « **Reply #56 on:** June 13, 2011, 08:19:25 PM »

Just to get back to topic. I made a few tweaks to the the Austrailia one, mainly about the unique wildlife and Aboriginal art. So i am reposting.
Thanks for this post it was just what I'm looking for for my lunchtime classes :D

adamwatch · « **Reply #57 on:** June 13, 2011, 08:32:59 PM »

Abo art now you will confuse the Koreans! They think all Ozzies are white! By the way why are there so few Oz teachers here?

Adam

Klogical · « **Reply #58 on:** June 13, 2011, 08:36:20 PM »

Quote from: adamwatch on April 06, 2011, 03:33:10 PM

"I know this has been debated endlessly, but a degree does at least show some level of academic commitment and success".

**A degree can just mean you were too lazy to get a job and you could afford the fees. It has nothing to do with teaching in most cases.

Adam

or you come from easy credit land UK and could borrow enough to keep you going for....8 years lol ;-)

it means youve jumped certain scholastic hoops.. teachin is a different ball game to academic study in every sense - knowin your subject knowledge is a must but deliverin to 40 personalities and abilities for many hours a week is an art form - one i wish i could master!

Ktrumper · « **Reply #59 on:** July 18, 2011, 12:02:59 PM »

These are great. Thanks so much for the ideas. I was hoping to do a few summer camp lessons on countries around the world and these helped alot!

Author Topic: The 7 major English speaking countries. (Read 18739 times)

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